Need foyer/stairs/half bath help!!

sewwriterepeat

8 years ago

last modified: 8 years ago

I am working on our house design and I'm hitting a snag with our foyer area. Here are the details:

Foyer area: 8'W x 15'10"D

9' Ceilings

Stairs on the left up to bonus space/future bedrooms. Standard stair tread depth/height, etc. Nothing too steep.

Archway on left to Dining Room. Single doorway on right to Study.

Archway straight ahead to Hall/Living room.

Can/Should I fit a Half Bath under those stairs? I would really love to have a Half Bath so guests don't have to see or use my kids' bathroom.

If I can't fit a Half Bath could I do a 90 degree turn to the right a little more than halfway up the stairs (with a landing) and still have room to walk under it to the Archway to the Living Room?

I can't seem to wrap my head around stairs and how they fit into a space :(

Featured Answer

PRO

Nugent Design Build, LLC

8 years ago

A minimum of 80" ceiling height is required at the front of the toilet fixture to meet code. A rule of thumb for head height under the stairs is to use 10" treads and 7.5" risers, then subtract 12" to allow for a self-supporting bannister. Using this simplified formula, the front of the toilet must be a minimum of 11'-0" from the base of the stairs. Therefore, your current configuration would leave a maximum of 1'-10" of space remaining for the sink and doorway. It could work with a 1'-6" door and a very narrow or corner sink. This results in a very very tight space that I wouldn't recommend! Can you eek out another 2'-0" in Foyer length? I hope this helps!

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Comments (11)

PRO
Tumblewood Designs
8 years ago
I don't see why it wouldn't fit the way you have it drawn in. I've seen it done plenty of times. If there is room I'd recommend a pocket narrow pocket door :)
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sueplatt
8 years ago
Are you against using space in study? On wall opposite of bookshelf. It would bump out into the study and you could place a closet or desk in the open space thus squaring the study. The entry would then be left whole and you may be able to have space for an L-shaped stairway.
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sewwriterepeat
Original Author
8 years ago
@ Nugent - I don't think I can make the foyer any longer. How long would these stairs be? What dimensions would you recommend for this type of half bath? I am open to a small corner sink.
PRO
User
8 years ago
I think you have great ideas, but I would hire a professional to insure that you have a good design and that it meets code. When they see the space they might come up with other options for you.
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User
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
"How long would these stairs be?"

"9' Ceilings"

To figure out the actual room under the stairs, we need to know the elevation difference from floor to floor. In other words, what type of floor joists/trusses are you using and how much height will that add to the 9'? It could be 10'-1" total rise or as much as 11'-2". Here are code minimums for stairs.

http://publicecodes.cyberregs.com/icod/irc/2012/icod_irc_2012_3_sec011.htm

7 3/4" rise and 10" tread.

121" ÷ 7.75 = 15.46 or 16 risers and 15 treads

15 treads × 10" = 150" for total stair run. 158" would be much better.

You are only showing about 135" which is about 15" short of what you need. Some of that could be hidden in the floor joists above the hallway, but that probably would mess up the upstairs floor plan.

Without checking Nugent's math, I would say that you need the extra 15" if you want a 9'ceiling, regardless of the powder room, but then you could probably do both. BUT, I would add 24" so that you could have more comfortable stairs.
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User
8 years ago
last modified: 8 years ago
"If I can't fit a Half Bath could I do a 90 degree turn to the right a little more than halfway up the stairs (with a landing) and still have room to walk under it to the Archway to the Living Room?"

Not in that tight of space. The landings necessary take up more room than you gain by turning the stairs. Somewhere on Houzz is a dilemma where I drew out all the possibilities, including winder stairs. They ended up going with an unconventional design where the newel post was offset at the landing turn to squeeze it in. It is asymmetrical and in my opinion looks like a mistake.
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sewwriterepeat
Original Author
8 years ago
Thank you Fred S. :) Your math helped me out a lot!!

Based on this math the front of the toilet would be ~33" from the sink wall... If I did a corner sink would that be enough room?

I had to go with the 150" stair run length since 158" would cut into the already-small archway for the dining room.
User
8 years ago
Some other codes to think about.

http://publicecodes.cyberregs.com/icod/irc/2012/icod_irc_2012_3_sec007.htm?bu2=undefined

http://publicecodes.cyberregs.com/icod/irc/2012/icod_irc_2012_27_par008.htm?bu2=undefined
User
8 years ago
What you have drawn seems to be about right IF the floor to floor measurement is 121". A little different way to go might be to push the stairs back into the hall wall 4". This would give you 7 9/16" risers and 10 1/4" treads (run) with a 1" nosing overhang for a total tread depth of 11 1/4" which is actually a significant improvement in how comfortable the stairs are.

This, however, gives you 29-30" between the wall and the front of the toilet instead of about 33". Here is how I might tweek it to get the best compromise, just to show another option. A 2'-4" door is big enough for that size powder room.
User
8 years ago
Something jumped out at me today that changes this a little bit. The exact wording in the IRC is not something I have paid attention to on this point because I have never tried to fit this into such a tight space, and have always been able to change the floor plans to include what is desired in better ways when starting from scratch. I think the headroom that we were using before is most comfortable, but the code actually allows for less due to how it says to measure the 80" (6'-8")

http://publicecodes.cyberregs.com/icod/irc/2012/icod_irc_2012_3_sec005.htm

2. Bathrooms shall have a minimum ceiling height of 6 feet 8 inches (2032 mm) at the center of the front clearance area for fixtures as shown in Figure R307.1. The ceiling height above fixtures shall be such that the fixture is capable of being used for its intended purpose. A shower or tub equipped with a showerhead shall have a minimum ceiling height of 6 feet 8 inches (2032 mm) above a minimum area 30 inches (762 mm) by 30 inches (762 mm) at the showerhead.

The clearance area shown in figure R307.1 is 21".

http://publicecodes.cyberregs.com/icod/irc/2012/icod_irc_2012_3_sec007.htm

That should give you another 10.5" over what I previously drew if you need it, but iI wouldn't push the toilet back any more than necessary or taller people could hit their head with that steep of ceiling.
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