Kitchen/Diner Layout

6 years ago

last modified: 6 years ago

We would love to hear your feedback on our new space and how to fill it.

We recently converted an integral garage and will be extending our kitchen to create an open-plan space of 5m x 10m

We have been to Wren Kitchens and picked out a modern kitchen style (Google: "Milano Ultra in Cloud", and see pics below) and had a go at a layout, but it does not quite feel right. We thought as a feature colour to have the island in "Pencil". Flooring anything we want. Going for a bespoke laminate worktop (dark grey / browns, wood effect).

We can be reasonably flexible with the window/door position and size on the new wall and the new lean-to roof will have a couple of skylights so should be nice and bright.

We need to fit a dining table (to seat 8) and it would be great to create a work area for a computer (but not necessary)

What do we think?

I am thinking the design is too spaced out. I think the left wall and a larger island would be enough, the island running parallel but with a double width. The worry being we leave to much space empty.

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PRO

Zenvida kitchens and joinery

6 years ago

no problem Alastair,

Ellie in above comment has a point, about the space in the render above. the render might not be to scale but even so, it makes everything very congested. it doesn't quite flow as well as it can.

you have a fantastic space available, your kitchen will look amazing in the end.

like i say to most of my clients, think first of all you practical and functional needs. design and aesthetics can fit in last. Most independent kitchen suppliers should be able to design your kitchen around you and your family needs in the kitchen.

i personally would incorporate a large rectangular feature island with seating for 8 incorporated within it by way of a connected dining table. please see some examples below. (something along these lines)

i wish you the very best of luck.

Please do post images on Houzz once your kitchen has been completed!

best regards

Harriett

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Comments (31)

PRO
User
6 years ago
Hi Alastair

I see this is a major project and I could help you if you can provide more information. Has the place been converted or it is in the planning stage? Would be required any structural works (new beams, columns etc. which will obstruct the runs), what will be ceiling heights, will the floor be even, can the extractor hood be ducted through the roof, water, gas, electric points existing (if yes where are they) or need to be repositioned, cannot see any windows? This will be to the start. Few pictures of existing place would be nice as well. I hope I do not scare you :) When we have the basic we could start the discussion of your needs for the new kitchen. If you prefer you can send all additional details directly to my email info@okbltd.co.uk
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
Dear Oliver
Nothing scarey no :)

The garage conversion was phase 1 and is complete.

Phase 2 is the extension (+ 3m x 5m). It is a complete refit. New floor. Ducted extractor - yes. North wall leads to the garden, can be anything. Thinking 3m x 2m sliding doors.

All beams in the ceiling (2.3m height), no pillars. Its a 10 year-old 2-storey town-house (terraced). Pics attached.

All services can be re-positioned. Gas, water, electric.

No planning required - all within constraints of allowed planning but have had checked with council anyway. Have architects plan.

Thank you.
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PRO
User
6 years ago
This helps a lot. Can you add the picture of the long wall, please? The space on pictures will be extended, can you confirm with the structural engineer it will be no beam supports sticking out of the walls, I have read above but just to be sure. I have been in this situation few times and have all the stories: extra pillars, columns in the middle of the room and this will cause a lot of hassle if not confirmed at the early stage of kitchen planning.A distance of 2.3m is to the beam or ceiling? I see the boiler, can you post dimensions or the model(old if you keep it or new if you replace), please? Can you list appliances and state which one integrated(built-in)? The flooring you mentioned anything you like but keep in mind extension will have fresh concrete and you will be much safer to use tiles, will you be installing underfloor heating? If yes you will have to have space for manifolds. I am sorry for so many questions but it usually takes around two hours visit on site to discuss all those details.
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
Oliver no problem, thanks for your interest.

Definitely no new columns.

There will be two horizontal beams above the new window/door similar height to what is there now.

2.3m to ceiling.

Underfloor heating: yes.

New boiler: Baxi Megaflo 24 (H: 780mm, W: 450mm, D: 345mm)

new Samsung RSG5MUBP1/X_BK American Fridge Freezer in Black

new integrated dishwasher

new built-in double oven (prefer bosch)

new induction hob

new cooker hood (ducted)

floor: prefer engineered wood as it will run to lounge area (or half and half)

Hope that helps
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
I will have to add the picture later but from the existing kitchen imagine it almost doubling in space.
PRO
Zenvida kitchens and joinery
6 years ago
Hi Alastair, Harriett here, hope I am able to help.

The space you will have is a very large space indeed. What you don't want is the kitchen units getting lost in the all the space you have. Have you considered taller wall units to go up to the ceiling, possibly 1000mm or 1100mm high. in such a large space if wall units are not extended up it can make the kitchen look too condensed. the taller wall units elongate the kitchen giving it a very nice aesthetically pleasing touch.

In addition, I would go for a bespoke island which can function exactly how you want it for you and your family. the island will undoubtedly be the main feature of the kitchen so it should be stunning and practical. as i far as i know, wren do not offer bespoke wall units or islands. are you London based? if so, I would be happy to come over and take measurements and provide

more detailed schematics and renders. have a look below at a kitchen i am working on at the moment, it shows detailed schematics including the actual appliance details as well as my 3d render.

and here is a bespoke island we are working on now for my client.
if you have any questions, please dont hesitate to contact me at harriett@zenvida.co.uk, i will be more than willing to help you out.
PRO
User
6 years ago
Hi Harriett

Not enough ceiling height for tall units.
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
Thanks Harriet - Interesting. I actually think the tall wall units look a bit odd, but it could be those units that are not appealing to me.
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
We are in North Yorkshire btw
PRO
User
6 years ago
Alastair Todd thanked User
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
That is the most logical way.
Do you not think its a bit busy?

Could the island and diner go horizontal (diner nearest window)?
What about L-shape instead of island with diner in window again?
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
Is that a real kitchen or a model?
My turn with the questions!
How exciting :)
PRO
User
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
We can change the position of the island and table but this will only bring the design to square one. The concept is to have kitchen area separated from the dining area. This setup gives you as well best way around the kitchen starting from two-hour shopping, getting this to the kitchen, the fridge is close to the entry, two towers, one with storage (the first tower is for boiler and UFH). Prep area either side of the hob with two double drawers 1 meter wide for plates and pans. One of them should have an internal drawer for cutlery or maybe both of them(cooking spoons are always a nightmare to store). Raised b/bar it's a nice place to have the morning snack, sit children in the high chair and keep an eye on them when cooking or having a drink with friends at evening. And then cleaning the area with dishwasher under the drainer and large bin on the right side of the sink. The rest is storage. I will have a very busy weekend so if you take time and discuss it with your family and friends, let me know what would you like to change and I will come back to it next week. I tried to pick closest colour and style to your choices but it is not an exact match. I work with higher quality manufacturers (what does not mean more expensive). The one on pictures (it is rendered 3D, not a real kitchen, yet :) ) you can find here Crown Imperial (look for Furore, Rialto and Calypso). Have a good weekend.
Ellie
6 years ago
I am not too sure how accurate the pics are just above, but it doesnt look like there is enough room for that island and dining table. You wouldnt be able to have people sit at dining table and island at same time. Also the walls would perhaps be marked on pulling out the dining chairs.
Ellie
6 years ago
Alastair, looking at your measurements and what you are trying to fit in looks very similar to my post just a few days ago!

Please have a look and give me any thoughts you have https://www.houzz.co.uk/discussions/kitchen-space-help-floor-plans-included-dsvw-vd~5046709
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
Woooooo now that is really cool

Great idea!

Thanks Harriet
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
architect designs...i think i probably missed some key parts sorry
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
In terms of functional, we require:
- double the storage we have now (8 units)

- decent fridge/freezer size (built in won't cut it even if full size each) - we have 3 baby boys who will eat!!

- 1 double oven

- built-in dishwasher

- i am the cook and spend a lot of time here. i want fridge, food cupboards and cooker and hob to be in good positions

Style is very important to us, minimal and modern. matt over gloss.

Thank you
PRO
User
6 years ago
Hi

I had finally chance to check on the plans you have posted. Not good news. Neither of above layouts will work. The extension part has a different width than the house and you have boxed pipe which cannot be removed. I will strongly advise using professional help of the kitchen designer who can spend time with you and your partner to discuss various options. I think the most important will be to decide where you want to have kitchen and dining table, how much space you want to use for lounge and what island style and type of usage you need. Try to establish capacity for fridge and freezer space. Make a list of priorities as you may not be able to have everything you wish for. Hopefully, you will find someone good in your area, not sale person interested in making a sale or giving you false hope of something that cannot be done.
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
This is the latest design...
PRO
OnePlan
6 years ago
Oh dear - that won’t work either ?! I second the call for you to get a credible designer on the case !
(Like us for example !)
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
Care to elaborate?
PRO
OnePlan
6 years ago
4055 width of room - minus 600mm cabinets on left
600mm cabinets on right
900mm island
Leaves not enough walk way either side !
If the island was a freestanding piece that could be moved you could probably get away with it - but as a fixed piece it’s not enough walk way between working parts of the kitchen and island.
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
Its going in the old space which is 4780mm. The island is a double unit depth.

I understood minimum clearance to be 800mm? We have at least 1000m...
minnie101
6 years ago
I'm useless at kitchen design but to me it doesn't seem overly safe or practical. I wouldn't like people sat next to the hob and they're also in the prep area. It's quite a distance from the hob to sink for draining veg etc. Although there's a set down area next to the oven, think about carrying hot dishes to put in soak past people. As I say I'm not a pro so not sure if this would work but a simple change might be to swap oven and fridge. Also put the hob the other side of the island. Keep the stools on the right of island but move others to end. I might also frame the fridge as it might work better aesthetically. Do you also not want a larder with a large family? Where's the dishwasher?
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
All valid points @minnie101. Larder was an option. We have a utility, its the wall next to the cooker tall unit. (converted WC). Some design tweaks gone in to ask to switch the cooker and fridge to their other respective ends. Dishwasher is to the right of the sink. I find the practical vs functional/storage one hard to weigh up. One big thing for us was having more space.
PRO
User
6 years ago
Having kitchen in the older part of the house will not provide enough natural light but is possible. Where will be boiler placed? if you move hob on the wall run with double oven tower you may have a better workflow. Remember to keep a gap between the island and fridge more than 1000 mm due to difficult access when opening. You need minimum 1000 mm between oven and island, safety required to remove hot dishes from the oven when you stand in front of it. You can get more storage if you use extension part and place shallow base units, maybe some open units for books, perhaps glass wall units for display items.
Alastair Todd thanked User
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
Yes was thinking that - the boiler has to go on new wall in extension, so could blend with slim wall units
Alastair Todd
Original Author
6 years ago
last modified: 6 years ago
And yes its not the best for light - but I guess this is where you weigh up priorities. Old is roomier than new. We have two large light sources at either end of space + the new ext. has 2 x velux roof lights. Plan to compensate with plenty of nice hanging lighting in kitchen. Noted on the decor, it does need it. The plan is to cover the wall space between wall and base units with matching laminate. Jury still out on colour but please see Wren's "bespoke laminate" its actually very nice. The wall covering is called "Tek". https://www.wrenkitchens.com/kitchens/worktops
Elizabeth Clark
6 years ago
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